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tensenervoushaddock
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Joined: May 20, 2006
Posts: 472
Location: Wiltshire

PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 12:49 pm Reply with quote Back to top

the bail arm will snap over sending the lead along the pier?[b]

Newton's Laws of motion apply even on piers...if the weight is heading seaward when the snap occurs it will continue seaward afterwards.
.....unless you can explain using some other physical laws.

edited by steve(dontcatchmuch) on 6/6/2011
 
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eccles
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Joined: May 19, 2005
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Location: Hayling Island, Hampshire

PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 4:05 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Let's not go OTT about this. We all know that crack offs invariably end up with the sinker and rig disappearing sea-ward at 90 mph so the possibility of someone getting hurt on a pier/whatever is very low. Certainly I have seen crackoffs occuring on piers with the rig always vanishing to the horizon.
 
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flattiefanatic
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Joined: Oct 03, 2007
Posts: 2237
Location: Doncaster, South Yorkshire

PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 8:36 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Discussions like this can go either way, not sure this is heading the right way. Can we please refrain from any personal insults, im sure as adults we can keep the discussion civil otherwise i can see this thread being locked.

P.S On a side note, why cast from a pier when the fish are under your feet. When fishing from a shore you would love to cast near a gulley or sandbank or rocks to try and find that fish holding area. Surely a pier has to be the biggest fish holding area winking
 
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dontcatchmuch
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 11:50 am Reply with quote Back to top

as flatiefanatic says posts like these can go either way .so i will be keeping a very close eye on this one .please refrain from personal remarks or i will lock this post
thank you steve (dontcatchmuch)
 
davcon4005
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Joined: Apr 24, 2011
Posts: 27
Location: Teesside

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:54 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Thank You All for your replies. I have just bought 55lb line and it will be all the way through, don't think I will have any problems.. I am hoping to get out this weekend. I will let you know how I get on. Once again I thank you all, it is a real comfort that I can pick the brains of seasoned fishermen/experts. TY VM
 
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rabbi2
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:57 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Now you will have a problem as the tide will play havoc using 55lb line due to its thickness. You will have dificulty holding the bottom even in a moderate tide. Use you 18lb line and a length of your 55lb line as shockleader
Cheers
keith big grin big grin
 
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baitdigger
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Joined: May 03, 2008
Posts: 442
Location: Clare / Galway Border

PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:30 am Reply with quote Back to top

tensenervoushaddock wrote:
the bail arm will snap over sending the lead along the pier?[b]

Newton's Laws of motion apply even on piers...if the weight is heading seaward when the snap occurs it will continue seaward afterwards.
.....unless you can explain using some other physical laws.

edited by steve(dontcatchmuch) on 6/6/2011


~This assumes that the crack off happens at the end of the arc of the cast and not during the cast. Shock leader is a safety device to protect others around you amongst other things. Your reply seems to be in the minority with most people taking due consideration for other anglers welfare and using an appropriate shock leader.
Oh and didnt Newton discover that what goes up must come down by having an apple falling on his head, he was fairly lucky it wasn't a sky flying lead happy
 
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tensenervoushaddock
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Joined: May 20, 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:19 am Reply with quote Back to top

I'm off from this forum as sensible replies are being moderated.... but before I go I will add this

in the pendulum cast the power is applied when the lead is behind and to the left of the left shoulder....look at youtube vids....if a snap off occurs when that power is applied the lead will continue to go in the direction it was heading which will NOT be safely out to sea but up the beach, pier, or wherever endangering others.

I did say that only an idiot would pendulum cast from a crowded pier, perhaps that should have read....only those who think Newtons Law works differently for them... rather than idiot.

If you do a simple overhead cast then the lead is only ever heading seaward as the power is applied when the lead is behind you and the power is applied towards the sea.....the lead can go in no other direction. It can not go sideways up the beach or pier....it is an impossibility.


My answer may be in the minority....it is a minority of people who have a scientific/engineering education and an understanding of Newton's Laws that predict the trajectories of objects and an understanding of how forces act ......other than apples falling out of trees.

People who cannot work things out for themselves have to blindly follow 'rules' made by others....not realising that 'others' have as little understanding as them.

Shockleaders are definitely absolutely needed if you are built like a brick outhouse and power cast.
Shockleaders are not definitely absolutely not needed for flicking light leads out from piers or into the shallows from a beach.
Sensible people will be able to work out where they are on that scale and use/not use a shockleader according to the style of fishing they are doing.
 
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baitdigger
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Joined: May 03, 2008
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Location: Clare / Galway Border

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:25 am Reply with quote Back to top

tensenervoushaddock wrote:
I'm off from this forum as sensible replies are being moderated.... but before I go I will add this

in the pendulum cast the power is applied when the lead is behind and to the left of the left shoulder....look at youtube vids....if a snap off occurs when that power is applied the lead will continue to go in the direction it was heading which will NOT be safely out to sea but up the beach, pier, or wherever endangering others.

I did say that only an idiot would pendulum cast from a crowded pier, perhaps that should have read....only those who think Newtons Law works differently for them... rather than idiot.

If you do a simple overhead cast then the lead is only ever heading seaward as the power is applied when the lead is behind you and the power is applied towards the sea.....the lead can go in no other direction. It can not go sideways up the beach or pier....it is an impossibility.


My answer may be in the minority....it is a minority of people who have a scientific/engineering education and an understanding of Newton's Laws that predict the trajectories of objects and an understanding of how forces act ......other than apples falling out of trees.

People who cannot work things out for themselves have to blindly follow 'rules' made by others....not realising that 'others' have as little understanding as them.

Shockleaders are definitely absolutely needed if you are built like a brick outhouse and power cast.
Shockleaders are not definitely absolutely not needed for flicking light leads out from piers or into the shallows from a beach.
Sensible people will be able to work out where they are on that scale and use/not use a shockleader according to the style of fishing they are doing.


An object at rest will remain at rest unless acted on by an unbalanced force. An object in motion continues in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.
This law is often called
"the law of inertia".
so i guess an unbalanced force could be a bail arm accidentally snapping shut half way through a cast?
I am familiar with a few of Newtons simpler theories but with all your education you are only considering an overhead thump at or around ninety degrees to the pier or beach. it is not taking account of any problems which may occur before the rod is facing forward, i'm sure you have seen these at mackerel fishing venues?
Whilst many anglers will be able to fish quite safely without a shock leader it is not best practice.
If everyone were able to work things out for themselves what need would we have for forums?
 
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flattiefanatic
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Joined: Oct 03, 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:29 am Reply with quote Back to top

I think this thread has run it's course and should be locked.

P.S In reply to tensenervoushaddock. Sorry you feel that we over moderate. As i have stated before threads like this generally go the wrong way, and ive seen a few. Sorry to hear your leaving the forum but that's your choice.
 
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dontcatchmuch
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:42 am Reply with quote Back to top

hi all
i do appreciate that every one is entitled to there say but i think this threed has run its cause now so im going to lock it be fore it gets out of hand
cheers stev
 
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